Welcome to Norbury Watch

I  created this blog as a way of bringing together details of news and issues about the the Norbury area of the London Borough of Croydon, given the growing number of community and other types of organisations active in the area and the events they run, and the wide range of issues of concern to residents.

Sean Creighton: sean.creighton1947@btinternet.com

I am a member of the Love Norbury Planning and Transport Committees and Chair of the Norbury Community Land Trust. I research and publish on aspects of Norbury’s history. I also run a blog site on Croydon event, issues and news:

https://seancreighton1947.wordpress.com

Four Residents Associations work together through the Love Norbury Partnership

Love Norbury also has the Knitting Norbury Together group.

A range of activities are offered by: 

local faith groups

the Allotments Society

Friends of Norbury Park: fnorpark@outlook.com

Friends of Norbury Hall Park: http://norburyhallpark.org.uk

Manor Farm Reserve group

British Legion club

Norbury Bowling Club

Norbury Park Lawn Tennis Club: https://clubspark.lta.org.uk/NorburyParkLTC

Cassandra Learning Centre

Norbury Park Residents Association:

https://norburyparkresidentsassociation.wordpress.com

Having been registered Norbury Community Land Trust is preparing ways to publicise its aims and seek members.

Norbury is divided into two electoral wards along the railway line with two Councillors each:

Norbury & Pollards Hill:

Vacany: due to death of Maggie Mansell

Norbury Park:

sherwan.chowdhury@croydon.gov.uk

Norbury is in Croydon North Parliamentary constituency. The MP is Steve Reed

https://www.stevereedmp.co.uk

Updated 7 January 2019

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Norbury events & news at 22 March

Star

St Philip’s Church, Beech Rd 

Tuesday 26 March. 11.30am-1pm. Women’s Coffee morning

Monthly support group for women who have suffered a miscarriage or lost a child. A share space to share experiences, listen and support each other.

Norbury Muslim Centre, 1116 London Rd, SW16 1DT

Contacts:

Afsha – 07944 224982

Rifka: rifkalodhi@gmail.com

Saturday 30 March. 11am-1pm. Manor Farm Nature Space Spring Planting Workshop

Manor Farm Spring Planting 30 Mar 19

Norbury & Pollards Hill Ward Crime Statistics 13-18 March

Burglary Residential 13 March. 4pm NORTHBOROUGH ROAD
Possession Cannabis 15 March. 8.20pm LONDON ROAD
Possession Cannabis 9pm KILMARTIN AVENUE
Common Assault 16 March. 8.30pm EDERLINE AVENUE
Criminal Damage Vehicle 17 March.  4am LONDON ROAD
Public Order 18 March. 8.50pm POLLARDS HILL NORTH

 

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Petition to support Co-op store on London Rd

I have started a petition to support the proposed Co-op store on London Rd.

Co-op Petition

The developer had withdrawn their first planning application for turning the empty properties on London Rd into a new Co-op store because the Council planners had indicated that they would oppose on the grounds that two former residential units would be used as staff facilities, and that they would want the proposed replacement block of flats on Fairview Rd and the London Rd store to be party of a joint application. Such an approach would delay bringing back the empty shops into use, thereby prolonging the blight along London Rd.

For background see

https://norburywatchblog.wordpress.com/2019/02/21/planners-propose-to-reject-refurbishment-of-london-rd-properties-for-co-op-store

https://norburywatchblog.wordpress.com/2019/03/01/co-op-and-other-norbury-news-and-events-at-1-march

The developer has now submitted a revised application, taking account of matters raised with it by the Love Norbury Planning Committee.

https://publicaccess3.croydon.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?keyVal=POAP0LJLKQ600&activeTab=summary

The statutory consultation ends on 12 April.

It is aware that unless the planners change their mind and refuse then an appeal will have to be submitted.

Norbury Green Residents Association held its AGM on Tuesday. At my request it discussed the plans for the Co-op.

There was surprise that the current site will be closing; shock that it is to become a block of flats. There was a complaint that the mini co-ops are always more expensive because of the range of goods stocked.

General consensus was in favour of my proposal to campaign to support the planning application for London Rd as separate from the Fairview Rd block.

The other three Association Committees have yet to take a view.

In view of the support at NGRA for my proposal, it was possible to start collecting signatures on the petition I have started as an individual resident.

If you agree please print it off, sign it, and ask your friends and neighbours to do this same, and send the signed sheets to the address on the petition.

Co-op Petition

Thank you

Sean Creighton

 

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Labour’s Leila Ben-Hassel wins Norbury & Pollards Hill By-election

Labour’s Leila Ben-Hassel has been elected as the new Councillor for Norbury & Pollards Hill Ward in place of the late Maggie Mansell.

Leila won 1,379 votes (64.5% – down 3.3%)

Conservative Tirena Gunter 324 (15.2% – down 6.9%)

Independent Mark O’Grady 162 (7.6%)

Rachel Chance (Green) 91 (4.3% – down 6%)

Independent Malgorzata Roznerska  72 (3.4%)

Lib Dem Guy Burchett 70 (3.3%)

UKIP Kathleen Garner: 40 (1.9%)

Added 16 March

Steve Reed, MP video with Leila Ben-Hassel:

 

Inside Croydon report:

https://insidecroydon.com/2019/03/15/tory-vote-slumps-to-15-as-ben-hassel-wins-in-norbury

See also:

https://www.onlondon.co.uk/croydon-comfortable-hold-for-labour-in-norbury-pollards-hill-by-election

 

 

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Norbury news at 12 March

STOP PRESS: Due to a change in circumstances

this is the last posting for the time being

Norbury Trading Estate

The closing date for consultation remains 14 and 21 March for the two schemes. However the Council has made it clear that residents comments received after that date will continue to be accepted and considered.

60 bed Care Home for 66 Pollards Hill North

PHRA held a public meeting on the home care plans last  week. It will finalise its submission for the closing date of 14 March. Once again residents who miss that date can continue to send in their views. Building on work as a member of the Croydon Unite Retired members branch working party on the housing needs of older people, Sean Creighton has submitted an objection in a personal capacity on the grounds that the proposal is over development, and not in line with planning policies of elderly housing. This can be read here:

66 Pollards Hill Objection Sean Creighton

Dubious posters

A previous posting reported that posters supporting one of the independent candidates had been fly-posted along London Rd, and that the posters did not contain the name and address of the  person responsible for printing them (usually the election agent), as required by law.  In fact there is a very very thin line down the edge which is difficult to see and read.

Controlling Houses in Multiple Occupation

The Council is introducing a special power that will give it extra control over the development of one type of houses in multiple occupation, the turning of family houses into shared housing.  The LNPC has submitted a paper supporting this and making a number of other recommendations. It can be read here:

HMO submission Love Norbury Planning Committee

Norbury & Pollards Hill Ward Crime Statistics

(1)   26 February to 4 March

Burglary Residential 26 Feb. 9.20am POLLARDS HILL SOUTH
Harassment 5pm NORBURY COURT ROAD
Theft from Motor Vehicle 27 Feb. 1.30pm NORTHBOROUGH ROAD
Common Assault 28 Feb 7.30am LONDON ROAD
Burglary Residential 2 Mar. 4pm DARCY ROAD
Possession of Cannabis 3 March. 2.55pm POLLARDS HILL NORTH
Possession of Cannabis 4 March. 0.30am STANFORD ROAD

 (2)   4- 9 March

Theft from Motor Vehicle 4 Mar 0.2am BENNETT GARDENS
Possession of Cannabis 0.30am STANFORD ROAD
Attempted Burglary Resid 6am LONDON ROAD
Public Order 5 Mar. 12.50pm LONDON ROAD
GBH 4.45pm LONDON ROAD
Criminal Damage 6 June. 7.40pm LONDON ROAD
Criminal Damage 7 June. 1.13am GRANDEN ROAD
Other Theft 8 Mar. 3am LONDON ROAD
Arson Vehicle 9 Mar. 5.42am MELROSE AVENUE

 Attempted stabbing in Norbury shop

https://www.mylondon.news/news/south-london-news/police-release-more-details-attempted-15929614

SERA Barn

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Pollards Hill Care Home public meeting 7 March

Pollards Hill Residents Association

Public meeting on proposed 60 bed care home

Thursday 7 March.11am-1pm

St Philips Church Hall, Beech Road

PHRA has invited CHURCHGATE SERVICES (the development Company) to speak about their proposal.

This will be an excellent opportunity for residents to get an insight on the plans and to ask questions.

Below is a link to the application documents
https://phranorbury.us13.list-manage.com/track/click?u=89bc1c1e8082c4ca2c58aa369&id=88a29ac791&e=6970f570a0

The closing date for placing your views

(for/against) is Thursday 14 March 2019

For background see:

https://norburywatchblog.wordpress.com/2019/02/20/churchgate-services-proposes-60-bed-care-home-in-pollards-hill

 

 

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Norbury Muslim Centre Open Day 3 March

Visit My Mosque Day Poster

I thought it might be useful for residents who are not Muslims had a summary a summary of key aspects of the similarities and differences between Islam and Christianity  from a non-Muslim perspective, and some extracts from my talk last year on the faiths of First World War soldiers for the Faiths Together in Croydon event organised by Norbury resident Astaq Arain of the Muslim Association of Croydon.

Shared belief in One God and the Bible

Both Christians and Muslims believe in there being one God. In the Old Testament of the Bible it is the Jewish Jehovah. In the Qur’an it is Allah.

Christianity grew out of Judaism in Palestine about 30 years after the birth of Jesus with the New Testament added to the Bible by the first disciples.

Islam as set down as the word of Allah in the Qur’an by the Prophet grew out of religious beliefs in the Arabian Peninsula in the 7thC after the birth of Christ linked to some of the ideas in Judaism and Christianity.

Christians and Muslims believe the Bible to be holy scripture.

Muslims add as long as it does not contradict the Quran

There is a shared belief in the existence of the same people including: Adam as the first man, Noah with his Ark, Abraham or in Islam Ibrahim as the first Muslim, Moses or Musa, Joshua or Yusha, David or Dawud, John the Baptist or Yahya, Mary, the mother of Jesus, and Jesus as the Son of God in Christianity and as a prophet in Islam

Rules of Behaviour

Christianity: Bible Ten Commands, Sermon on the Mount

Islam:  Qur’an, Hadith

There is debate about what is meant

In Islam there is a principle that where there are differences of opinion there should be dialogue to reach consensus and an application of reason.

Sharia law (path to water – to the good life)

Concept of sin

Christianity has a belief that humans are born into sin. Mankind  is inherently evil and is in need of forgiveness of sin. By knowing right and wrong Christians choose their actions. Humans are a fallen, broken race in need of salvation and repair by God, and that Jesus died to redeem them.

Islam has no concept of original sin, nor atonement. All Humans are born sinless, but human weakness leads to sin. Humans are born pure and innocent. Upon reaching adolescence, you are responsible for what you do, and must choose right from wrong. Islam also teaches that faith and action go hand-in-hand.

‘Sinful’ behaviour

Christianity and Islam:  murder, theft, adultery

Islam: money lending, cowardice, slander (inc. gossip and bad language), use of drugs

Hell

Christianity: A place of everlasting punishment for the unrighteous

Islam: A place of torment and fire. Hell is known as Jahannam. Jahannam has several levels and a person may not necessarily spend eternity there.

Prayers :

Christians believe in prayer but there are no set times a day.

Muslims should pray 5 times a day, and are required to go to a mosque on Fridays

Rituals:

Christianity: The Sacraments, including Baptism and Holy Communion (Eucharist). In Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism, five more are added, viz: Confirmation (Chrismation), Marriage, Penance, Holy Orders and Annointing of the sick.

Islam: Five important rituals (known as the pillars of Islam):
1. Shahadah – A profession of faith.
2. Salat – Prayer five times daily.
3. Zakat – alms giving.
4. Sawm – Fasting during the Holy month of Ramadan.
5. Hajj – Pilgrimage to the Holy city of Mecca.

Pilgrimage: Canterbury, Lourdes, The Hajj to Mecca

Charity

Christianity: it is good to help the poor and to give to charity. Some of the newer independent churches tithe a percentage of their members’ income for their activities e.g. helping the poor.

Islam: 2.5% of wealth paid as a tax – zakat: property and essential goods excluded; plus additional fundraising

Differences or Misunderstandings

Rivalry and hostility between both religions

Rivalry and hostility between the different groups within each religion

Personal obligation: Muslims are to strive to think for themselves and take responsibility for their own actions

Catholics can confess and receive forgiveness for errors, bad behaviour and sin

Attitude to eating animals

For Muslims the pig is unclean. Killing an animal must be by a correct method – halal. Halal means ‘what is permitted’ What is not permitted like pig meat is haram

Attitude to alcohol

Many Christians drink wine which has been blessed by the priest as a symbol of the blood of Christ

Some Christians e.g. Methodists prohibit drinking alcohol

In Islam alcohol is haram

Use of images

Christianity: allowed

Islam: not allowed.  Art takes the form of calligraphy, architecture etc.

Marriage

Christianity  – Holy Sacrament. Catholics believe that priests and nuns should be celibate. Monks and nuns can leave society by going into monasteries.

Islam is opposed to monasticism and celibacy. Marriage is strongly recommended. Men can only marry the “people of the book” i.e., Abrahamic religions. Women can only marry a Muslim man.

Confessing Sins

Protestants confess straight to God, Catholics confess mortal sins to a Priest, and venal sins straight to God (Orthodox have similar practice).

Anglicans can confess to their priests but this is considered optional.

Islam: Forgiveness must be sought from God, there is no intermediary with him. If any wrong is done against another person or thing, forgiveness must first be sought from them, then from God, as all of God’s creation have rights that must not be infringed

Islam: You are judged according to your efforts to do good and to avoid sinful behaviours, oppression, etc.

God will judge your deeds and intentions. A person must believe in God and follow His commandments.

Goal

Christianity: To love God and obey his commandments while creating a relationship with Jesus Christ and spreading the Gospel so that others may also be saved.

Islam: Fulfil gift and responsibility of this life through following the guidance of Holy Quran and Hadith, striving to serve mankind through compassion, justice, trustworthiness, and love for all of God’s creation

On Other Religions

Many Christians believe all other religions are false. Moderates may or may not believe this. Most Muslims believe all other religions are false. ”

Music

Music is an important part of Christian practice. There are disagreements about its role in Islam, with some saying it is allowed and others saying it is not.

Sufis: Ta’zieh is a passion play, part musical drama, part religious drama, rarely performed outside Iran.

Shia: Ashurah music is performed during the Muharam mourning period, commemorating the deaths of Imam Hussein and his followers.

Thikiri (from the Arabic word “Dhikr” which means remembrance of God— (East and Southern Africa (Tanzania, Mozambique, Malawi, Zimbabwe, and South Africa).

Manzuma – moral songs performed in Ethiopia.

Mad’h nabawi – Arabic hymns praising the Prophet.

Key Shared views – promises

not to consider any other creature above the Creator.

not to idolize or bow to anything – in whatever form – in this universe, apart from your Maker.

not to misuse the name of your Creator by insult, or belittle faith in the Divine.

to stop work and peacefully join together at least once every week for Prayer.

to be good to your mother and father.

never to murder any inviolable soul.

not to commit adultery beyond of the sacred bond of Marriage.

never to steal.

not to lie or accuse your neighbour or anyone else falsely.

never to reach or invade your neighbour’s house; or wife, or anything that belongs to your neighbour.

Muslims on the Western Front in the First World War

By 1919 India had sent 1,096,013 men overseas in the Indian Army to fight for Britain in the First World War. They comprised which comprised 400,000 Muslims,  100,000 Sikhs and up to 800,000 Hindu soldiers. The first Indians were sent to the Western Front as quickly as possible arriving in France from mid-October for a year. They comprised infantry, cavalry, pioneers and sappers and miners. They fought in the trenches. Their different religious beliefs and dietary needs were catered for, including the supply of live sheep and goats for meals killed in the prescribed manner. The Indian Soldiers’ Comfort Fund was set up on 1 October and raised £1m from the British public and businesses. The Indian Army then fought in other theatres of war, especially the Middle East.

Duse Mohammed Ali

From January 1917, the Eygptian-Sudanese Muslim Duse Mohammed Ali, restarted The African Times and Orient Review. Ali’s activities had included the  promotion of improved understanding about Islam in Britain. Its penultimate issue just as the War started included details of the Anglo-Ottoman event raising money for the Red Crescent Fund for Britain War Relief. Having been a leading member of the London Islamic Society, in 1915 he founded the Indian Soldier’ Widows and Orphans War Fund, which was linked with the All-India Muslim League.

The gratitude towards the contribution of colonial troops and merchant seamen to the war effort was soon forgotten in the land that was meant to be made ‘fit for heroes’. Riots broke out against them in port cities in 1919, including against the Yemeni Muslim community in South Shields.

Noor-un-Nisa (Nora) Inayat Khan

She was a Muslim who became the first British Special Operations Executive radio operator agent in the French Resistance, code named ‘Madeline’, and awarded the George Cross posthumously. In November 1940 she had joined the Women’s Auxiliary Air Force, and then transferred to the SOE. She was night dropped into France in June 1943, and was betrayed and arrested in  October. On November she escaped but was recaptured and sent to Germany. She did not break under interrogation. She was sent to Dachu concentration camp, where she was executed in September 1944.

 

 

 

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Co-op and other Norbury news and events at 1 March

Co-op store changes withdrawn; Litter highlighted in Independents campaign in by-election; planning news; Norbury & Pollards Hill Ward Crime Figures 19-25 February

Co-op store changes withdrawn

In the light of the Planners intention to refuse the plans to convert 1485-9 London Rd for the new Co-op store on the grounds that two former upstairs residential units are going to be used for staff facilities, the applicant has sensibly withdrawn the application. Their agent has informed the Love Norbury Planning Committee that it is considering other options, and they will have a joint chat about these on Tuesday 5 March, including about the thinking on the main building along Fairview Rd. The Committee did inform the Planners that it did not support the proposed refusal on the grounds that the loss of two flats is more that compensated by the proposed 55 flats the developer is considering to replace the existing block.

For background see:

https://norburywatchblog.wordpress.com/2019/02/21/planners-propose-to-reject-refurbishment-of-london-rd-properties-for-co-op-store

Litter highlighted in Independents campaign in by-election

https://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/17458121.meet-the-independent-candidates-for-the-norbury-and-pollards-hill-election

For bac

Editorial comment. Litter and fly-tipping is a major problem across the country and all Councils are struggling. The cause is people dropping plastic and take-away packaging, dumping mattresses and other possessions instead of taking them to the dump or paying the Council to take them away. The real question is how can behaviour be changed. This is very difficult regardless of political persuasion.

The Council has fined and prosecuted 525 people for littering since last May with 11 prosecutions. Council action has included confiscating and crushing fly-tippers vehicles. The Council has taken the anti-litter campaign into 38 schools. Stuart Collins, the Cabinet member for trying to clean up Croydon, has spoken at Norbury Residents Associations meetings since 2014 explaining the policies and procedures, and has also helped on Clean Up days around the Borough, including those organised by Love Norbury picking up litter along London Rd.

If an Independent, Conservative, Lib Dem or Green candidate is elected in the by-election they need to explain what ideas they have for changing the behaviour of those residents and visitors that do the litter and fly tipping, and how they will work with the Council, Cabinet Member and Don’t Mess with Croydon team to change behaviours and encourage people to take pride in Norbury.

Dubious posters

Posters supporting one of the independent candidates have been fly-posted along London Rd. e.g. empty shops between Subway and Fairview Rd. The posters do not contain the name and address of the  person responsible for printing them (usually the election agent), as required by law.

Events

Sunday 10 March. Norbury Hall Park Clean-up. 10am-noon

Sunday 10 March. 9.30-11.30am. Pollards Hill Residents Associations  Clean-up.

On the top of the hill.

Saturday 16 March. Love Norbury Clean Up Day

Cancelled

Tuesday 19 March. 7.30pm.  Norbury Green Residents’ Association AGM

Thursday 4 April. 7pm. Pollards Hill Residents Association AGM.

Friday 12 April. Family Time Half Term Fun Day – Kids Arts and Crafts

Cassandra Centre, 1433A London Rd (entrance in Stanford Rd)

To book email: womencircle@cassandracentre.org.uk

Saturday 13 April. Scots Estate Residents Association Barn Dance

St Philip’s Church

Saturday 27 April. Norbury Village Residents Association AGM

Harlow Hall, entrance Oakhill Rd (off Stanford Rd)

Guest speaker; Stuart King, Cabinet member for Transport and Environment

Saturday 9 or 16 June. Love Norbury Summer event

St Helen’s Crescent

Week 6 May. Love Norbury AGM

Date to be fixed according to venue availability

Sunday 9 June. Love Norbury Fun Day

Mondays. 5.30-7.30 pm Chess at the Cassandra

Cassandra Centre (above Lloyds Bank, side entrance on Stanford Road)

From £5 per session

Organised by Richard Weekes Chess Academy 07538 035896

Research suggests that children who learn chess perform better in school, have improved calculating ability and are more imaginative, creative, and self-motivated. Chess also helps to improve decision-making and challenges both girls and boys of all abilities to think. That makes chess fun and easy to learn and play!

Police Community Contact Sessions

5 March. 4-6pm

12 March. 2-4pm.

21 March.4-6pm

Norbury LPT base, 1342-1344 London Road

Planning News

Extension behind shop next to Lloyds Bank

A full application has been submitted for the retrospective approval of the additional extension at the rear of the refurbished shop frontage next Lloyds Bank.

https://publicaccess3.croydon.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=dates&keyVal=PN5YBGJLITE00

This has been submitted following investigation by Planning Enforcement at the request of Love Norbury Planning Committee.

318 Norbury Avenue & Planning Enforcement

The Love Norbury Planning Committee referred the retrospective application on the already built rear extension to this house to the Council Planning Committee in order to raise concerns about Planning Enforcement.  The Council Committee discussed it on Thursday 28 February. The application had been made by the current owner because the previous developer owner had not submitted an application for it, nor for presumed planning development rights for a roof extension nor the construction of a building in the garden. Love Norbury had been pressing for action against the developer during the building works. In its statement to the Council Committee it regretted that the new owner had been put into this position. Quoting the National Planning Framework Guidelines statement ‘Effective enforcement is important to maintain public confidence in the planning system’, it pointed out that the neighbours have felt let down. The Committee unanimously  approved the application because it did not accept that the extension was too large and consisted that under planning rules it could have been built even larger. It  did not agree Love Norbury’s request that Building Control should check whether the developer had complied with Building Regulations. Nor did it agree the request that the operation and resourcing of Planning Enforcement  be reviewed. The Head Planner told the Committee that the Council had an up-to date local enforcement plan as recommended in the National Policy Framework Guidelines which was on the Council website. Love Norbury Planning Committee has emailed him to say that this appears to have been undertaken without public consultation or review by Councillors on the Scrutiny & Overview Committee.

Norbury & Pollards Hill Ward Crime Figures 19-25 February

Criminal Damage Vehicle 22 Feb. 8.30am NORBURY COURT ROAD
Shoplifting 3.15pm FAIRVIEW ROAD

LONDON

ABH 4.10pm SEMLEY ROAD
Theft from Motor Vehicle 8pm FAIRVIEW ROAD
Burglary Residential 8pm NORBURY COURT ROAD
Common Assault 8.30pm STANFORD ROAD
Common Assault 23 Feb. 5.37pm HATCH ROAD
Common Assault  8pm LONDON ROAD
Other Theft 8pm LONDON ROAD
Criminal Damage 25 Feb. 10pm LONDON ROAD

 

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